Where are the surprising, exciting, visionary new cars?

"Porsche was my first word" (porschewasmyfirstword) 10/05/2016 at 11:16 • Filed to: None

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Do automakers lost their balls, their passion, sniffed not enough petrol or got high on tire rubber anymore? I believe so.

I mean, come on, was the AMG GT R suprising? Was the convertible GT surprising? Maybe the Mustang 350r Shelby. But it still reeks of marketing and numbers.

Porsche? Na, the 911R is living of the LE hype. Land Rover/Range Rover is same styling up and down the scale, as well as Jaguar. Same with McLaren? Buick Avenir? Will never see the light of real day. Lamborghini? Yawn. Everything quite predictable. Oh, on’t tell me about shed racers. They have to step up the game because they live of the madness.

What do I want then? More Alfaness in the world, more Kei-car cuteness out of Japan, more Peugeotermination all around. What’s Peugeotermination? Lets May and Clarkson explain (jump to minute 45).

edit: some example. Renault Clio V6, VW GTI, VW Phaeton, Alfa 4c or Hellcats as mentioned by Chan, first Renault Espace, first gen. retro 500 and Mini, Fiat Panda, first gen. Miata, Bugatti Veyron, to some degree Porsche 918, Ferrari FF, Citroen DS, first gen. new Bentley Continetal. First gen. Cadillac CTS-R wagon.

TheHondaBro > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:20

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I’ll just leave this here.

Because 340hp TURBO Honda.

yamahog > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:21

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I’m not sure what the presence or lack of delicate danglies have to do with the auto industry.

But what do I know, I just work on cool stuff for a living.

TheHondaBro > yamahog 10/05/2016 at 11:28

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delicate danglies

Berang > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:30

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Berang > yamahog 10/05/2016 at 11:30

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You’re thinking of the wrong kind of balls.

Obviously automakers have lost their marbles.

yamahog > Berang 10/05/2016 at 11:32

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Per the rules of jinx, you now owe HondaBro one Coke.

yamahog > TheHondaBro 10/05/2016 at 11:33

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U like that alliteration? ;) ;)

Porsche was my first word > yamahog 10/05/2016 at 11:36

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It’s just a saying, you know?

What do you work on?

Porsche was my first word > Berang 10/05/2016 at 11:37

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Sorry, just another Civic R. The first VW Golf GTI is the level of surprise I mean.

Porsche was my first word > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:38

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As to proof me wrong I found this link just down there.

http://oppositelock.kinja.com/hyundai-veloster-road-trip-review-1787409154

Just a little more of juice in it ...

TheHondaBro > yamahog 10/05/2016 at 11:38

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It’s lovely.

*crosses legs*

yamahog > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:39

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It’s a shitty saying. Think about it.

And the type of thing I can’t discuss before it’s released.

Berang > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:39

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What about BMW i8 level of surprise? Did you really see that one coming? I doubt it.

Xyl0c41n3 > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:46

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Lol. You serious?

Xyl0c41n3 > yamahog 10/05/2016 at 11:47

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Dis is why I love you. 

Pacer Racer > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 11:48

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I’ll tell you where the excitingly good stuff is coming out of now adays: Hyundai.

Think about it, this was the company that was making Excels and Ponies 25 years ago, and today they make Gensis Coupes and Velosters. Both of those cars came completely out of left field, and took out the competition that had years and years more experience. Granted, today Hyundai is in need of another revival, because most of its products are a few years old, but as of 3 years ago, they were the one to watch.

Ford has also been tearing it up lately. Nobody expected a new 300hp AWD Hot Hatch, least of all Subaru whom thought they had the market cornered with their WRX, until BOOM! Focust RS. Ford followed this up with the new GT, another car that nobody was really looking to see happen, and man is it gorgeous. This “Ford’s Got its Mojo Back” thing really started in 2010 with the ST/SHO/Explorer Sport/Raptor introductions, and since then they’ve been tearing it up in just about every measurable way.

Even brands like Cadillac that have long been dormant have been showing promise.

So yeah, Mercedes and BMW and Jag and LR and the Supercar manufacturers have grown complacent...come on, when weren’t they complacent? It’s not like they were the most exciting things of the 60s, or 70s, or 80s, or 90s....they’ve always been set in their ways, their “image”.

TL;DR: The exciting stuff is happening downstream from the playground of the wealthy. If you want innovation, look at the common man’s sports car.

Aaron M - MasoFiST > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 12:10

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Turbocharged Kia Soul.

I mean, I was surprised.

Porsche was my first word > Pacer Racer 10/05/2016 at 12:29

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I totally like what Hyundai is doing. Now wonder they are gaining. But groundbraking? Risktaking? I dont see it. I really don’t.

Talks about an AWD Focus have been around since last generation. Talk Clio V6 and I’m listening.

Porsche was my first word > yamahog 10/05/2016 at 12:33

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I know. But it get’s the point. Balls are commonly associated with boldness. In my opinion in way that you know it might be stupid but you do it anyway. Bravery I wouldn’t describe with having balls.

But get my right, what is a better saying to imply someone hasn’t the courage to do sth.

Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 12:36

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Give Hyundai time, they are just starting to roll stuff out from their “N” division.

Porsche was my first word > Berang 10/05/2016 at 12:36

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I would give the i3 more credit. But yes, I did see that, but not really on the streets. It was there as a concept way before the release. Dead cold when finally there.

Would Porsche pull that off ... But no. Next gen 911 as a hybrid is not surprising anymore.

RUF, the all famous manufacturer who bases it’s cars on Porsche had a all-electric 911 out a long time ago. Had Porsche had adapted that as soon as possible, that would have been a suprise.

Tesla proofed a all electric sports car could work. Low center of gravity.

And don’t tell me it was to late in development process of the 911. They could have skipped to years easily in development. There is still no real competitor out there for the 911. Delay the new model but skip a whole generation. That would have been a leap instead of a step.

Yes, the purist buyers would cry, but they do anyway. Jaguar is back on the road to success since they kind a skipped there heritage.

Berang > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 12:39

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Do you think maybe you’re just determined to hate good things?

Porsche was my first word > TheHondaBro 10/05/2016 at 12:43

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Give my 500hp and I might listen. Or mid-engine. Or hybrid-performance hatchback. Or, I don’t know. I wanna see something I couldn’t imagine. There are people paid for beating my imagination. But I don’t see them earning their money lately.

Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 12:44

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its not enough to be bold, one also needs to execute the design and sell.

Take Cadillac for instance, their CTS and ATS were steps away from the traditional Cadillac norm, the V cars are incredible and even were put into wagon form. The Coupes are pretty wild looking. I think what Cadillac started doing 10 years ago was pretty bold to move into the performance segment, and they by all objective accounts have executed well but it hasn’t really resulted in the kind of sales that they would like.

Alternatively look at a company like Fiat. Weird designs, with interesting spec sheets that continually fail to live up to expectations. It’s a lack of execution but still reasonably good sales because of the uniqueness.

Companies stay conservative because it’s hard to put all three of those things together boldness, execution, and sales.

I think each manufacturer has some unique things in their lineup. The i3 is bold for BMW, the volt is bold for Chevy, Ford’s higher trim offerings are unexpected. The Fiat 500 Abarth is another unexpected car.

Porsche was my first word > Berang 10/05/2016 at 12:46

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I wanna deny that. The compact cars are better than ever. I like the Jags, I love what Maserati is doing. I totally adore the E-Mehari. I’m pretty sure there are a lot of cars out there that make my handy shaky when I drive them. But that’s not the point. I wanna see a company doing “Let’s try this”.

Porsche was my first word > Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle 10/05/2016 at 12:55

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I think what Cadillac started doing 10 years ago was pretty bold to move into the performance segment,

Exactly. 10 years ago. But 10 years I was dating another woman, lived in another city, had another occupation, liked other food, didn’t like whisky, thought I’ll be married soon.

Just being bold isn’t what I want to see. I want to see it an company with genius, with imagination. I think there was a piece on Jalopnik a while ago about concept cars. Once concept cars showed how the designers thought the future would be like. Today they just testing what appeals to the customer. The don’t need to revolutionize (‘cause business case. A business not making money is no good business). But show us something new, something fresh. A leap instead of a step. A Phaeton. A CTS-R wagon. Not that Mini-thing. Same iteration of the basic design again and again. I like the Fiat 500 better. BTW the way, the MkI Panda was a revolution. The Citroen Pluriel. The Nissan Juke. Where is the car about which you wonder “Do they really sell this”?

Maybe Citroen will deliver. They are ditching the hydropneumatic system. Wonder how they want to improve that.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 12:59

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I’m going to leave out the brands that are known to make crazy sports cars. So forget Porsche and the Italian bros.

Interesting/bold cars in the past 3 years:
86 twins
ND, 124 Spider
BMW i8
Fiesta ST, Focus RS
AMG GT
Jag F-Type
Hellcats
Jeep Renegade
Alfa 4C

Upcoming:
Alfa Giulia
Civic Type R (even though I think it looks awful)

None of these are mainstream, high-volume or even “safe” products. If you don’t find something bold or daring in each of them, then we can agree to disagree.

Porsche was my first word > Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever 10/05/2016 at 13:11

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86 twins - introduced 2011, almost a full model cycle ago. But right direction

ND, 124 Spider - collaboratin announced a long time ago. Only surprise was Mazda is willing to share the Miata plaform.

BMW i8 - teased as concept way before release

Fiesta ST, Focus RS - just successors

AMG GT - also just a successor
Jag F-Type - known since 2011. Talks about an e-Type successor since ever.

Hellcats - that’s what I’m talking about. But Challenger been around for a while.
Jeep Renegade - Ugh, really? Just a rebadged version of totally expected inevitable version of a small crossover.

Alfa 4C - Yes, like this. But unfortunatly around since 2013.

Upcoming:
Alfa Giulia - talks going on like forever. They want to revive Alfa like since they opened factory gates. But I admit I didn’t expected it to be rear wheel drive and Quadrafoglio molto piccante
Civic Type R - successor.

Don’t get me wrong, I like some of the cars. I’d love to drive a Guilia or an 124.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 13:17

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To me, a car only matters when it goes on sale. The fact that it’s been shown as a concept doesn’t really sway me.

Also, an exciting car that continues a limited-production nameplate is still an exciting car to me. The alternative would have been to discontinue it, and that would be boring. See what happened to the Honda S2000.

Also exciting: NSX. Not my cup of tea and IMO overpriced, but still a neat car and people overhype the old one as if it were the first Japanese sports car ever.

I’ve also forgotten the continuation of Cadillac’s V lineup. I’m not the target market, but I’m glad it exists.

What really doesn’t excite me is the dilution of AMG and M. Those names have filtered down to models that aren’t really that sporty, but I know it’s a marketing experiment to see if whoring out those labels will increase sales.

I have driven a 124. It’s a great cruiser but having also driven an Abarth 500, I’ve come to expect a little more noise. The base 124 is a relatively quiet car.

yamahog > Porsche was my first word 10/05/2016 at 13:24

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You could say one’s lost their nerve, bravado, swagger, sense of adventure, etc.

Porsche was my first word > yamahog 10/05/2016 at 13:25

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Like bravado.

Porsche was my first word > Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever 10/05/2016 at 13:51

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To me, a car only matters when it goes on sale. The fact that it’s been shown as a concept doesn’t really sway me.

But to a certain degree I’m familiar with it when I’ve seen it as a concept. Sure, I meant only cars on sale or supposed to go on. But it applies to concept cars as well. The don’t fullfill their function anymore. They are not visions anymore. I want carmakers to put out visions.

I’ve also forgotten the continuation of Cadillac’s V lineup. I’m not the target market, but I’m glad it exists.

That is the point.

I don’t understand the S2000 isn’t/wasn’t selling like hot bread. Maybe back in the time you wanted a little more sex in your engine? Good for car industry I don’t have to make the decisions it seems.